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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 15 Jul 2013 :  08:40:41  Show Profile
It really is remarkable that over the last few weeks absolutely nothing has been heard from the Parish Council as to their action or, indeed, thoughts, about the proposed developments east of Roundstone Lane.

Sure, if asked, they'd say they're working hard behind the scenes, dangers of compromising the outcome, and so on but their lack of communication is just not good enough.

What is their thinking? Have they, as some suspect, accepted the inevitability of development. If that's the case, they should have the guts to come out and say so. Or, if they're mounting a robust defence, what is it?

As has been said many times by contributors to the forums the prime job of Councillors is to represent the village, not just to inflate their own importance. If the latter is happening, you know who you are!
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neil
Forum Owner / Moderator

United Kingdom
2623 Posts

Posted - 15 Jul 2013 :  08:59:58  Show Profile
Totally agree with you DD. And not sound from APC about their invite to the infamous undemocratic meeting with ADC and developers due to take place on 6 August!
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Robinf
Senior Member

105 Posts

Posted - 15 Jul 2013 :  09:15:05  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by neil

Totally agree with you DD. And not sound from APC about their invite to the infamous undemocratic meeting with ADC and developers due to take place on 6 August!



I am in the process of writing the APC to determine exactly what they are up to but I'm not holding my breath that I'll get an answer of any substance. In fact if Cllr Bicknlells is typical of other APC Cllrs to go by (and I sincerity hope he is not), I don't expect to get an answer at all. He is obviously to busy with important matters of State to bother himself with the concerns of the people who elected him.
Derek is absolutly right - there is a serious lack of communication, in fact at the moment and for the recent months past it's all been a bit of a monologue.
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neil
Forum Owner / Moderator

United Kingdom
2623 Posts

Posted - 15 Jul 2013 :  09:17:53  Show Profile
SAV have now told us that Arun District Council will be appointing consultants "to review the data used to obtain the high housing figures to see if it is correct".

I wonder who will appoint the consultants? The Planning Officers themselves? If so I think we can be sure that the consultants chosen will just confirm the high housing figures required which the Planning Officers incorporated in the draft Local Plan.

I'm sure that the Planners/Developers will try and make political capital out of today's report that there are not enough affordable homes in the South of England. However, as we all know from past experience in Angmering, most of the "affordable homes" that will eventually be built across the district will just not be affordable to the people who really need them as developers maximise their profits.
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Robinf
Senior Member

105 Posts

Posted - 15 Jul 2013 :  09:30:47  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by neil

SAV have now told us that Arun District Council will be appointing consultants "to review the data used to obtain the high housing figures to see if it is correct".

I wonder who will appoint the consultants? The Planning Officers themselves? If so I think we can be sure that the consultants chosen will just confirm the high housing figures required which the Planning Officers incorporated in the draft Local Plan.

I'm sure that the Planners/Developers will try and make political capital out of today's report that there are not enough affordable homes in the South of England. However, as we all know from past experience in Angmering, most of the "affordable homes" that will eventually be built across the district will just not be affordable to the people who really need them as developers maximise their profits.



I have asked SAV if they know who the consultants are and if they know who has appointed them, the planners or the LPSC? In any event you can bet your bottom dollar that LPSC and the planners are working hand in hand on this one. Another question is, have ADC used them before and for what and what was the outcome of any reports? I'm sure a little investigative time into who the consultants are, who hired them, might reveal some interesting business relationships both past and present.
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Pansy
Senior Member

United Kingdom
172 Posts

Posted - 16 Jul 2013 :  17:21:44  Show Profile
The whole issue of planning in Arun really stinks to high heaven. ADC have a planning department so why do they have to employ expensive Planning Consultants that are costing council tax payers money? Yet again meetings are being postponed; getting ammunition ready to blow to pieces any opposition to the decisions they have already made to impose a large number of houses in Angmering and the three villages and turn them into Garden Cities!
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 16 Jul 2013 :  17:58:37  Show Profile
The Consultants have been appointed to examine the basis of housing
numbers. Expensive, Yes, but probably better than letting the lunatics of ASC Planning report on the asylum. In most peoples' eyes they have the credibility of a newt.
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luckyduck
Moderator

United Kingdom
169 Posts

Posted - 19 Jul 2013 :  20:59:54  Show Profile
that is very unfair to the newt
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 19 Jul 2013 :  22:05:57  Show Profile
On the News page it is reported that at the APC meeting the Chairman
"referred to derogatory comments being made on the Angmering Village Life website, which he believed would be answered by people coming into the office rather than taking cheap pot-shots, which were inaccurate and unnecessary."

So now perfectly valid questions as to APC's stance on development are 'cheap pot shots'! Pot shots they may be, although I think the accuracy may improve, but cheap? Hardly.

They would not be necessary if the Council made its position clear and respected its constituency. Incidentally, as possibly one of the targets of the Chairman's comments, I am still awaiting a response to the question raised in the appropriate section of AVL about the lack of courtesy being displayed to Save Angmering. Weren't questions supposed to be answered in three working days, or once again does arrogance supplant all other concerns?


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neil
Forum Owner / Moderator

United Kingdom
2623 Posts

Posted - 19 Jul 2013 :  23:27:43  Show Profile
quote:
in the appropriate section of AVL

I think you mean the Angmering Forums. See my comments today in Organisations & Clubs Forum.
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Robinf
Senior Member

105 Posts

Posted - 20 Jul 2013 :  06:07:32  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by neil

quote:
in the appropriate section of AVL

I think you mean the Angmering Forums. See my comments today in Organisations & Clubs Forum.



Looks like that no matter what forum was it was, that the comments have hit a raw nerve at APC. But let's us all hope that APC can respond in a professional manner to the issues raised.
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Sue Ware
New Member

United Kingdom
4 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2013 :  13:44:38  Show Profile
Thanks Robinf for your posting of July 15. On July 17 I sent a Freedom of Information request to ADC which can be seen here: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/consultants_reviewing_the_shma_d#incoming-411837 This gives links to the Brief that will be given to the Consultants when they are appointed and states "The Chief Executive Officer in consultation with The Leader of the Council, Cabinet Member for Planning and Infrastructure and the Chief Executive Officer will be deciding which Consultants to use and making the appointment".
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Sue Ware
New Member

United Kingdom
4 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2013 :  13:47:01  Show Profile
Over the last few weeks comments have been made by a number of individuals regarding the delay in securing response from Angmering Parish Council to the proposal made by Save Angmering Village that a meeting between the two parties be scheduled to discuss possible collaboration

In the interest of transparency, and given that the issue of containing large-scale development is of such importance to the village, SAV felt it should publish the content of the communications from both parties so that an objective judgement on the current situation can be made.

On 21 June, Save Angmering Village wrote to the Parish Council:

Although there has been significant delay in a decision being reached on the proposed housing developments, it would appear that we are now approaching the point where ADC will be making a judgement as to where and how many houses are to be built.

While we understood the reluctance of APC during the early application stages to be seen to remain unbiased in their stated position, that position, through the letters of objection you have produced, is now a matter of record. That said, we are constantly being asked by our supporters what stance the Parish Council is now taking, and the action emanating from that in terms of ensuring Angmering is not unduly disadvantaged.

We were struck, when attending the event organised by the Three Villages Action Group (who might be regarded as our competitor in the allocation of housing numbers) by the active collaboration which seemed to exist between that Group and their respective Parish Councils, something which we feel it would be important at this stage to replicate if at all possible.

Nick Herbert attended the festival and gave a speech fully supporting their 'fight'. When we spoke with him, the inference was that Angmering might not be so lucky in resisting proposed major house building. We feel that this could be because we are seen as not being strong in our joined approach to resisting unsustainable development.

We would like to ensure we provide a factual response to supporters on the nature of APC activity and would therefore propose a meeting whereby this can be ascertained. We look forward to hearing from you as to when this could be arranged.


On 16 July Angmering Parish Council replied to the email but omitted to reply to our request for a meeting

Thank you for your email of the 21st June and we apologise that it has taken time for us to acknowledge your email .

We would like to advise that we have today posted on to our web site the Parish Council’s position in respect of the August meeting arranged with ADC and developers/land owners of Roundstone Lane.


APC's website states: Whilst it does not endorse any development on this site and the Parish Council's position on the existing planning applications is a matter of public record it is the Parish Council's intention for the Clerk to attend this meeting in order to observe and report back.

SAV's email of 16 July

Thank you for your email.

The last paragraph of my email of 21st June requests a meeting with APC. Could you let me know what dates and times are available for this meeting, please?


prompted the Parish Council's response on July 24:

The Parish Council will be discussing the details of the meeting that will be held on the 7th August between ADC and the developers and at that time the Parish Council will also discuss how they will engage further with the Parish on the future of proposed developments for Angmering.

It is likely that the Parish Council will hold a public meeting, possibly as early as September, at which all members of the public will have an opportunity to provide their input and ask questions on the possible way forward for the Parish. Also by that time the Neighbourhood Plan will be in an advanced state and the details and evidence that have formed that document will be able to be taken account of in the discussions.

We will be in further contact with you after the 7th August.


SAV's request for an early meeting has gone unanswered but we look forward to hearing further as to the action the Parish Council intends to take.

Sue Ware
Save Angmering Village (SAV)
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2013 :  18:04:42  Show Profile
Interesting that in the responses from APC chronicled in Sue Ware's posting, there is no indication of a willingness, as requested in the initial e-mail, to set up a meeting to discuss common interests. Indeed, as with the Chairman's response earlier in the week to my own question, no mention whatsoever.

Once again, the question must be asked as to the credibility of the Council if it treats people in this manner. There is no doubt that some Councillors do a good job but they must be aware that the reputation of the Council as a whole is being besmirched by the attitude of certain other individuals who appear to care little for the village and its residents.

Presumably they take this attitude secure in the knowledge that they are safe in their positions, buttressed by the apathy, unfortunately, displayed by many.

Come on Mr Chairman, demonstrate some real leadership and get the Parish council's house in order!
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potty
Junior Member

United Kingdom
15 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2013 :  19:45:57  Show Profile
quote:
it is the Parish Council's intention for the Clerk to attend this meeting in order to observe and report back.
but who is observing the Clerk!!! its a meeting of such importance that a knowlegable parish councillor should attend to represent Angmerings interests.
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HanceR
Junior Member

United Kingdom
28 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2013 :  20:32:14  Show Profile
Can we trust a parish councillor or even the clerk to represent the parish?

Richard Hance
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 06 Aug 2013 :  15:51:06  Show Profile
Tomorrow is the meeting between ADC Planners, Councillors and Developers regarding developments in Angmering. Will we hear outcome? Don't hold your breath. After all, we're only the people who pay for them all. But, as a representative of the Parish Council is also attending, and you're interested in the workings of this wider 'secret' cabal, make sure you bombard them in next few days with request to reveal all. We must 'hold their feet to the fire'!
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 14 Aug 2013 :  07:51:15  Show Profile
It's been a week now since the meeting referred to in previous post. Whilst it would be too much to expect information on the nature and outcome of that meeting, think the Parish Council has to answer some simple questions. Is APC supporting development, fighting against development, or taking the view that it's a done deal and they can do very little to stop it?

I'm posting same question in APC section and look forward to receiving straightforward response. An ongoing strategy of saying nothing really isn't good enough.
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HanceR
Junior Member

United Kingdom
28 Posts

Posted - 14 Aug 2013 :  08:03:08  Show Profile
GOOD FOR YOU DEREK IN KEEEPING THE PRESSURE ON APC

Richard Hance
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Robinf
Senior Member

105 Posts

Posted - 14 Aug 2013 :  08:51:00  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by derekdainton

It's been a week now since the meeting referred to in previous post. Whilst it would be too much to expect information on the nature and outcome of that meeting, think the Parish Council has to answer some simple questions. Is APC supporting development, fighting against development, or taking the view that it's a done deal and they can do very little to stop it?

I'm posting same question in APC section and look forward to receiving straightforward response. An ongoing strategy of saying nothing really isn't good enough.



Type in Angmering Parish Council into Google search and it comes back with "Angmering Parish Council serving the residents of Angmering West Sussex".

Unless APC has posted something on the website (which I can’t see they have) or popped something on the parish notice board, it would seem that their communications department has gone into total paralysis on this issue.

Let’s all hope that they can be bold enough to give us some feedback on the meeting but at least as Derek requests, answer a few simple questions. If the answers come with warts, let‘s have them too. At least we would all know where we stood.

Perhaps "Angmering Parish Council serving some residents of Angmering West Sussex" might be nearer the truth.
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roosterbri
Advanced Member

United Kingdom
553 Posts

Posted - 14 Aug 2013 :  14:56:46  Show Profile
Lets be fair to them, there is only one meeting planned for August...albeit a Planning meeting on 20th. They have to get together to get their ducks in a row..
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doug
Junior Member

United Kingdom
22 Posts

Posted - 14 Aug 2013 :  20:28:12  Show Profile
Sadly I would seem the current apc cannot understand to whom the serve ( that's the electorate) not the corporationssadly the way of modern politics.
I challenge apc to answer the above concerns or to stand aside and allow a more representative open and communicative representation to answer the communities concerns.
I love my village I've based my business within, school my children within, and patronise as many local business' s as practicable but the developments proposed are in no ones interests a parts from the employees whom jobs depends upon target driven issues and the shareholders / bankers
Where is the plans for addition infrastructure, schooling, roads, water, drainage, jobs I'm no nimby but the plans are flawed beyond belief .
My apologies rant subdued
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luckyduck
Moderator

United Kingdom
169 Posts

Posted - 14 Aug 2013 :  20:31:34  Show Profile
Doug - I think you will find there are vacancies on the parish council, so you can always be co-opted
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doug
Junior Member

United Kingdom
22 Posts

Posted - 14 Aug 2013 :  20:47:42  Show Profile
Sadly although probably representative of the majority of the villagers concerns I do not fit the conservative mould ( or labour, green,liberal democrat) being a hippyesque scruffy fellow I would rile to many feathers to be accepted upon the outdated current system lol
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HanceR
Junior Member

United Kingdom
28 Posts

Posted - 14 Aug 2013 :  22:23:43  Show Profile
Doug

You do not need to be a Conservative or any other party member all you need to be is you and to represent the village and be willing to speak out.


Richard Hance
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 15 Aug 2013 :  07:48:46  Show Profile
What we need is an elected Mayor, someone who can be voted for on a laid down, regular basis, someone who is not party based but purely concerned with the betterment of the village.. That's the problem at the moment - unless the Councillors are willing to step down we can't get rid of them.
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luckyduck
Moderator

United Kingdom
169 Posts

Posted - 15 Aug 2013 :  08:21:14  Show Profile
The whole problem of parish councillors is not that they won't step down, it is just that when election times come around there are not enough people willing to stand, so there is effectively no elections, and the incumbents just keep on going. If more people would stand as prospective councillors we would get meaningful elections, and OUR choice of councillors. The parish councillors are not representing any political party on the parich council. Party politics starts at district level.
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patty
Advanced Member

United Kingdom
738 Posts

Posted - 15 Aug 2013 :  11:10:50  Show Profile
Luckyduck is so right.
A case of action speaks louder than words.
There are 13 Councillor vacancies at election time. If there are 13 or less applicants then they will all get in 'by default'.
We need at least 20 applicants to give people the proper choice.
BUT................how many of you have actually attended a PC meeting?
I know the big issue at the moment is housing development and yes that is uppermost in everyones minds, but that is not all the PC do.

ALL meetings are open to the public. The committees would love to see more members of the public come along and take part, take an interest, offer suggestions, guidance, ideas......yes, you can do that. Listen to how the committees have to work. See what they do, including all the mundane, day to day running of the Parish that can take up so much of their time.
The public are so important. We dont just want you coming along when there is a problem, we want you there the rest of the time, it is your village as well.
Having said that, if you do have a problem, come along to the relevant meeting and make your point. It has to then be dealt with.

Doug - your argument for not joining is poor - sorry. How you look, what you do, is totally irrelevant. the criteria is that you want to genuinely do something for your Parish. Yes it is frustrating at times, but if it is worthwhile, then it worth persevering.

I have said so many times in the past how the council would welcome more attendance from the public. I really mean it.

Please, please, please, get involved, spare some time, go to meetings, understand the workings, dont be scared to speak up and then................prepare to stand at the next election or better still, come forward to fill the current vacancy!!

any comments and views listed above are those of myself personally and not as a Parish Councillor, and in no way reflect opinions of the Parish Council or any other professional bodies
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 15 Aug 2013 :  13:11:56  Show Profile
Patty, your sentiments are correct as they usually are but the reason why people feel so disenfranchised is the apparent unwillingness of the Parish Council to engage with those who they allegedly represent. Engagement needs two parties. Apart from yourself, no-one else says anything so there shouldn't be any surprise when annoyance and irritation comes to the fore.
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seagull
Average Member

United Kingdom
49 Posts

Posted - 16 Aug 2013 :  15:56:19  Show Profile
I don't think it's the Angmering councillors you should be having a go at, in respect of the proposed developments east of Roundstone Lane. They have already objected to the three planning applications, so far submitted. It is the Arun District Council planning officers, who are obviously conspiring with the developers,
who we should be targeting, together with the District Councillors. The planning officers, Simon Meecham and Karl Roberts are the ones who seem intent on concreting over Angmering instead of more suitable sites. They are the ones who are talking to the land owners and developers and who instigated the 'useless' Visioning Brief. Perhaps we should spend more effort in lobbying our three District Councillors - Messrs Wensley, Bicknell and Cooper - after all, there are District Council elections next year!
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 16 Aug 2013 :  16:08:06  Show Profile
Believe me, that is happening as well. The Save Angmering website and regular Newsletters to supporters will confirm all the action that is being taken.

Gripe with APC is not that they are really able to stand in the way of development, but they don't come out and tell us what their view is. That, justifiably or otherwise, breeds suspicion as to their motives.

Their objecting to the original development applications is hardly a cause for unbridled applause. They had little choice. Can you imagine what would have happened if they had not?
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 17 Aug 2013 :  08:05:19  Show Profile
It would seem I have been acting under a misapprehension as to the purpose of the Parish Council Question and Answer session on AVL Forums. Question can be asked, but you cannot guarantee an answer. In the latest instance, just a sidestep to an APC communication.

An interesting document that says very little. One paragraph that does draw your attention:

For confirmation Arun District Council are responsible for the Local Plan which defines the development principles for the district and in addition are the decision making authority on planning applications.

In other words, if applications succeed, don't blame us Guv.

Encouraging to see Public Meeting is planned. We all remember how well the last one went!
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neil
Forum Owner / Moderator

United Kingdom
2623 Posts

Posted - 17 Aug 2013 :  08:12:56  Show Profile
I think that the statement issued by the Parish Council is not only pathetic but also shows continued contempt toward the residents of Angmering.

There is absolutely no reason why APC could not have issued a factual statement of what went on at the meeting - their one said nothing. Again we have to question as to whose side they are on, or at least those people preparing/issuing the statement!
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Nigel
Senior Member

United Kingdom
238 Posts

Posted - 18 Aug 2013 :  12:59:27  Show Profile
In view of the many concerns raise by the residents of the parish concerning ADC and APC's stance on future development within the parish, would it not be prudent, as Neil suggests, for the Parish Council to issue a factual report on the ADC meeting attended by the Parish Clerk on behalf of the parishioners. It must be of benefit for everyone to see,openly, what our parish council is doing, if only to give everyone reassurance in them or do we have to wait for the proposed public meeting (no date set) or the next council meeting in just under a months time.
APC....give your parishioners some consideration.
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 21 Aug 2013 :  15:06:42  Show Profile
As the Littlehampton Gazette pointed out last week, Councillor Cooper campaigned on the ticket of no unsustainable development in the village. Now that he's been elected, however, that stance seems to have shifted.

"if hundreds of homes were ultimately approved, he pointed out that a co-ordinated approach would be better than uncontrolled development offering little or nothing to benefit Angmering.

“To have a joined-up development would be better for the people of Angmering in the long run."


"Better for Angmering in the long run"? No, Councillor Cooper,not good at all.

A case, yet again, of campaigning in poetry but governing in prose.
Or, perhaps , the question should be "Have you been nobbled?"
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Robinf
Senior Member

105 Posts

Posted - 21 Aug 2013 :  16:00:49  Show Profile
Everybody has their price!!



quote:
Originally posted by derekdainton

As the Littlehampton Gazette pointed out last week, Councillor Cooper campaigned on the ticket of no unsustainable development in the village. Now that he's been elected, however, that stance seems to have shifted.

"if hundreds of homes were ultimately approved, he pointed out that a co-ordinated approach would be better than uncontrolled development offering little or nothing to benefit Angmering.

“To have a joined-up development would be better for the people of Angmering in the long run."


"Better for Angmering in the long run"? No, Councillor Cooper,not good at all.

A case, yet again, of campaigning in poetry but governing in prose.
Or, perhaps , the question should be "Have you been nobbled?"


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HanceR
Junior Member

United Kingdom
28 Posts

Posted - 21 Aug 2013 :  17:49:44  Show Profile
I am ashamed to admit I voted for Councillor Cooper now I feel completely betrayed. What are you about Mr Cooper?

Richard Hance
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Bert
Advanced Member

484 Posts

Posted - 21 Aug 2013 :  19:35:14  Show Profile
derekdainton.....exactly where and how, in the quotes you provide, does it indicate that Councillor Cooper has changed his personal view, in respect of large scale unsustainable development in Angmering?
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derekdainton
deleted

579 Posts

Posted - 21 Aug 2013 :  22:14:18  Show Profile
Are you saying he hasn't? Certainly would appear to be the case if you compare recent statement to his campaign literature.
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Chuckle Brother
Average Member

United Kingdom
42 Posts

Posted - 22 Aug 2013 :  06:52:39  Show Profile
The statement above seems very defeatist to me - not the statement of someone who intends to fight the development proposals for Angmering.

Given all that is going on across the district I was genuinely surprised that the people of Angmering returned a Conservative in the recent by-election - instead of sending a signal to the ruling elite at Arun that they were not happy it seemed to me more like a green light!! I can't help thinking that the Arun cabinet will have interpreted it that way too!
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